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Re: first-person cupcakes

grymalkyn@gmail.com said:
>> I am really sick of fiction that only works because the characters are
>> idiots, don't communicate, or both.
>
> Ah. The plot of every episode of Three's Company ever.

They had plots?

I've been watching Gargoyles (from Disney's Afternoon). I like it pretty
well, but *good gravy* are the gargoyles stupid! They never learn and
they're way too trusting. Some of it's naivete and 1,000 years cultural
difference, but still. The dumb is just painful.

Wayne

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Re: first-person cupcakes

I'm smack in the middle of Lighthouse Island by Paulette Jiles. Orphan on a failing earth. Drought, over urbanization, death of most of the animals, population oppression. It's beautifully written. Can't recommend it highly enough.

Leslie, who can't resist end of the world stories

Sent from my iPad

On Aug 25, 2015, at 12:28 AM, Ilana Halupovich <ilana.halupovich@gmail.com> wrote:

<snip>
I am not sure which one I have read, but according to the author, they are the same book, only the second one is "spiced up"

or something without too much romance - Resnick's Stalking Unicorn  - it's actually the first in the series, but I am yet to locate the other too at decent price.
https://www.goodreads.com/series/87057-gumshoe - Keith Hartman Gumshoe series.

One that I don't recommend is Katie MacAlister. The regular romance was OK, but the one with dragons could do better wit some cutting. 

                                Wayne

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Re: first-person cupcakes


I am really sick of fiction that only works because the characters are
idiots, don't communicate, or both.

Ah.  The plot of every episode of Three's Company ever.

Laurie

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Re: first-person cupcakes



<snip>
I must not have been clear.  I'm not looking for romances, but I really
do appreciate the suggestions.

Much easier:  Both "Thhe Little Old lady who Broke All the Rules" and "The Little Old Lady Who Struck Lucky Again"
Mark Simmons Dreamland trilogy
 
                                Wayne

PS. That sounds like a joke from a comedian from the 50's:  "I'm not
looking for romance, I'm married!"

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Re: first-person cupcakes

ilana.halupovich@gmail.com said:
> OK something not exactly romance and not exactly urban fantasy: Janet

I must not have been clear. I'm not looking for romances, but I really
do appreciate the suggestions.

Wayne

PS. That sounds like a joke from a comedian from the 50's: "I'm not
looking for romance, I'm married!"

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Re: first-person cupcakes



<snip>

I read the first -- You Slay Me -- and that convinced me not to read any

Yes, this one <SIGH> 

of the others.  I read it almost ten years ago, so I don't remember just
what I disliked about it.  But... no, no more of that.


OK something not exactly romance and not exactly urban fantasy: Janet Evanovich Stephanie Plum series. The books that don't have numbers in their title host something or somebody who may be not human.  
Romance, but non-fiction: Consuelo de Saint-Exupéry "the Tale of the Rose"
Urban fantasy, but not romance:Jane Lindskold "Brother to Dragons, Companion to Owls" 
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Re: first-person cupcakes

ilana.halupovich@gmail.com said:
> https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/15893107-belle-book-and-candle or
> https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/16277823-gentlemen-prefer-witches

I took one glance at the Belle page and thought, "Yeah, I'll pass." Then I
saw it was a Nick Pollotta book and thought that it might be pretty good.

> One that I *don't* recommend is Katie MacAlister. The regular romance was
> OK, but the one with dragons could do better wit some cutting.

I read the first -- You Slay Me -- and that convinced me not to read any

of the others. I read it almost ten years ago, so I don't remember just
what I disliked about it. But... no, no more of that.

Wayne

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Re: first-person cupcakes

<snip>
I am not sure which one I have read, but according to the author, they are the same book, only the second one is "spiced up"

or something without too much romance - Resnick's Stalking Unicorn  - it's actually the first in the series, but I am yet to locate the other too at decent price.
https://www.goodreads.com/series/87057-gumshoe - Keith Hartman Gumshoe series.

One that I don't recommend is Katie MacAlister. The regular romance was OK, but the one with dragons could do better wit some cutting. 

                                Wayne

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Re: first-person cupcakes

> I'm reading "Cupcakes, Trinkets and Magic", by Meghan Doidge. It's urban
> fantasy -- book one in the inevitable series. It's about a cupcake baker
> who is also half a witch. So far, there are vampires and werewolves, and
> it takes place in the Pacific Northwest. The vampires haven't started to
> sparkle yet, but it's early days.

A zombie showed up in the book. Of course.

I've finished this book now. It wasn't bad. There were some interesting
parts to it, and a couple good characters. The writing needs work and the
book needs editting. I'd say that the inconsistencies need to be cleared
up, but that'd completely disrupt one of the underlying plot points.

I have two big complaints about it. (Really three, but I've already whined
about the first-person.) First off, the heroine is an idiot. Time after
time after time, she kept saying and thinking and doing stupid things.
Certainly she had good reasons for not wanting to see who the Bad Guy was,
but when the reasons kept whapping her in the face with a shovel she should
have taken notice.

The second reason has two parts, but can be summed up as communications
problems. Second.1, the heroine's family kept her in the dark about a bunch
of things to "protect" her. Second.2, the non-heroine main characters kept
not communicating with the heroine, except by giving her significant looks.
And the looks were completely lost on the heroine because, as I said above,
she's an idiot.

I am really sick of fiction that only works because the characters are
idiots, don't communicate, or both.


ilana.halupovich@gmail.com said:
> Romances can be fun. If you want to read about Betsy the Vampire Queen,
> that thinks almost exclusively about shoes, try MaryJanice Davidson Undead
> series.

Ooooh, shoes! I *love* reading about shoes! That was the problem with the
cupcakes book. Shoes were only mentioned maybe 20 times. How on earth can
you have good character or plot development if shoes are mentioned so few
times?

> If you want a character that always knows who's responsible for her
> problems (clue - not her!), try Bitten by Kelley Armstrong.

I've read three of those -- Bitten, Dime Store Magic, and Stolen. They
weren't bad, but weren't great either.

Wayne

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Re: first-person cupcakes



On Sun, Aug 23, 2015 at 6:42 PM, Wayne Morrison <tewok@storm-monkeys.com> wrote:
I'm reading "Cupcakes, Trinkets and Magic", by Meghan Doidge.  It's urban
fantasy -- book one in the inevitable series.  It's about a cupcake baker
who is also half a witch.  So far, there are vampires and werewolves, and
it takes place in the Pacific Northwest.  The vampires haven't started to
sparkle yet, but it's early days.

By the end of the first chapter, I was annoyed with the baker.  The book
is written in first person, and the tone of what the baker is thinking,
some of the things she thinks, the perfection of her cupcakes, the names
of her cupcakes -- it's all adding up to a case of hyperglycemia.  The
book feels like a Mary Sue.

Anyone else read this book?  Does it get better?  Does the baker ever get
better or does it stays as sugary as it starts?  Is it not so much urban
fantasy as a romance slathered with UF elements?  Big Bad Wolf has already
made a play for the baker, and Evil Vampire is undoubtedly going to do the
same by the end of the book.  Still early in the book and it's pretty clear
who the Big Villain is, not to mention other things that are going to come
to light by book's end.


And that leads me to a more general question.  Why are *so* many books these
days written in first person?  There are certainly good 1P books, some of
whose authors I actively follow: Aaronovitch, McCullough, Jemisin, Butcher,
Briggs.  (Others aren't/don't tend to be 1P -- Gaiman, Martinez, Pratchett.)
Good books aside, it seems like there are piles and piles of 1P books that
are less than good.

It seems the majority of books I'm seeing these days are 1P.
It seems that many Urban Fantasy Romances end up being 1P.
It seems that many Urban Fantasy books are thinly disguised Romances.

Why are there so many 1P books these days?  Does it take less effort to
write?  Does it take less effort to read?  Is it a way to connect better
with readers?  Dunno 'bout anyone else, but this writer is getting really
sick of all the first-person books.

                                Wayne

PS. I know that there are going to be good and bad of whatever POV.  Just
'cause it's 3P doesn't mean it's good, as just 'cause it's 1P doesn't mean
it's bad.

PPS. I don't have anything against romances in particular.  I don't like the
deceptive feeling that I get from many of them though.  It feels like many of
them start with the author thinking, "I want to write romances, but that field
is glutted.  Anyone can write a dumb ol' fantasy book, I'll just throw some
vampires and elves at this romance and then I can be sure to sell it.  This
is a whole 'nother discussion.

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Romances can be fun. If you want to read about Betsy the Vampire Queen, that thinks almost exclusively about shoes, try MaryJanice Davidson Undead series. If you want a character that always knows who's responsible for her problems (clue - not her!), try Bitten by Kelley Armstrong. 
And there are always Esther Friesner's characters: the kid that's temping for gods and brother & sister who fight over the inheritance. :-)
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first-person cupcakes

I'm reading "Cupcakes, Trinkets and Magic", by Meghan Doidge. It's urban
fantasy -- book one in the inevitable series. It's about a cupcake baker
who is also half a witch. So far, there are vampires and werewolves, and
it takes place in the Pacific Northwest. The vampires haven't started to
sparkle yet, but it's early days.

By the end of the first chapter, I was annoyed with the baker. The book
is written in first person, and the tone of what the baker is thinking,
some of the things she thinks, the perfection of her cupcakes, the names
of her cupcakes -- it's all adding up to a case of hyperglycemia. The
book feels like a Mary Sue.

Anyone else read this book? Does it get better? Does the baker ever get
better or does it stays as sugary as it starts? Is it not so much urban
fantasy as a romance slathered with UF elements? Big Bad Wolf has already
made a play for the baker, and Evil Vampire is undoubtedly going to do the
same by the end of the book. Still early in the book and it's pretty clear
who the Big Villain is, not to mention other things that are going to come
to light by book's end.


And that leads me to a more general question. Why are *so* many books these
days written in first person? There are certainly good 1P books, some of
whose authors I actively follow: Aaronovitch, McCullough, Jemisin, Butcher,
Briggs. (Others aren't/don't tend to be 1P -- Gaiman, Martinez, Pratchett.)
Good books aside, it seems like there are piles and piles of 1P books that
are less than good.

It seems the majority of books I'm seeing these days are 1P.
It seems that many Urban Fantasy Romances end up being 1P.
It seems that many Urban Fantasy books are thinly disguised Romances.

Why are there so many 1P books these days? Does it take less effort to
write? Does it take less effort to read? Is it a way to connect better
with readers? Dunno 'bout anyone else, but this writer is getting really
sick of all the first-person books.

Wayne

PS. I know that there are going to be good and bad of whatever POV. Just
'cause it's 3P doesn't mean it's good, as just 'cause it's 1P doesn't mean
it's bad.

PPS. I don't have anything against romances in particular. I don't like the
deceptive feeling that I get from many of them though. It feels like many of
them start with the author thinking, "I want to write romances, but that field
is glutted. Anyone can write a dumb ol' fantasy book, I'll just throw some
vampires and elves at this romance and then I can be sure to sell it. This
is a whole 'nother discussion.

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Re: folklore/folktale question

I looked at TVTropes.com to see if they referenced any fairytale folklore.  In the "Examples" section, they do reference some literature.  It doesn't speak much about the evolution of the stereotype, but it's interesting reading, nonetheless.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/IndianMaiden


and a couple about princesses in general...I swear, every time i go to this website, I get lost for hours.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PrincessClassic


I'm sure this is all stuff you already know, but it's interesting to see it all neatly laid out in one place.

Mowg

On Sat, Aug 1, 2015 at 12:26 AM, Wayne Morrison <tewok@storm-monkeys.com> wrote:
piratejenny@verizon.net said:
> Anecdotal evidence: I've discovered an "Indian princess" (Mary Hyanno,
> born 1623ish) in Tony's genealogy.

Me too.  Kind of.  Sort of.  I've got a European ancestor whose last name
was, believe it or not, Princess.  She married a Native man.


> As to your more general folklore question, I'm guessing Maria Tartar has
> looked into it. I have a few of her books but I have yet to actually
> read them. It does sound right up her alley though.

Thanks for the pointer.  I'll see if I can find if she's written about
this at all.

                                Wayne

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Re: Anybody out there?-- Book Report

On 7/22/15 12:54 PM, 'Ellen Rawson' via Tamson House wrote:
> Have to recommend an incredible fantasy book, though: Naomi Novik's
> Uprooted. Loved it, loved it, loved it.

Thank you! It's really worth recommending! I don't have it fully
integrated yet, and it's certainly "different", but of course, that's
partly the point. It's the first of hers that I've read, and I'm going
to get another from the list in the back of the Kindle, but unlike with
many books by writers new to me that simply charm me, I'm not itching to
dive in to another of hers just yet: I need time to catch my breath.
She's absolutely Mythic, and I'm going to pass the recommendation on to
Charles' "Mythic Cafe" on FB. She has a very original imagination, not
just fed by all the other "High Fantasy" genre, but by Polish folk tales
(as opposed to the more Southern European and British folk tales that
are more part of the consciousnesses of most of us), and, I believe, her
own individual originality (along with the fact that she just happens to
be a FINE writer). The book has flaws, for my individuality, among them
entirely too much blood and gore (I thought that it was going to remain
at 93% forever!), that almost, in some of the worst places, caused me to
put the book down forever, but I didn't. And I wound up glad that I
didn't. Entirely uncharacteristic of it, but laudatory to her ability
(maybe she didn't even intend any humor, but my individual quirks
again), it's the first book in years that caused me to literally laugh
out loud in two or three places. I'm not sure that I'll do it again
when I reread (yes, I will be doing that, if I live long enough), having
been through the ugly parts (the laughs came quite early on), but just
once is a landmark for my reading life.




--
Sibyl Smirl
I will take no bull from your house! Psalms 50:9a
mailto:polycarpa3@ckt.net

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MASTER PSYCHIC READER~ ACCURATE & AMUSING

Your first 3 minutes are FREE talking live with me.

Please visit my website at: http://www.keen.com/Ask+Fran

Or, call me right now at: 1-800-275-5336 x0160

Have 25 years experience

Reads 24/7

E-mail: rodeodrive84@...

What clients say about Fran's readings:

"Thank you so much!!!!  I will call again. You were awesome!!"

"Best phone call ever! Amazingly accurate."

"Love it or hate it... Fran doesn't sugar coat. Awesome reader."

"Thanks Fran, I always feel so much better and whole as a person & myself after talking with you. I appreciate your memory from each time we leave off and pick up again. God bless.


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MASTER PSYCHIC READER~ ACCURATE & AMUSING

Your first 3 minutes are FREE talking live with me.

Please visit my website at: http://www.keen.com/Ask+Fran

Or, call me right now at: 1-800-275-5336 x0160

Have 25 years experience

Reads 24/7

E-mail: rodeodrive84@...

What clients say about Fran's readings:

"Thank you so much!!!!  I will call again. You were awesome!!"

"Best phone call ever! Amazingly accurate."

"Love it or hate it... Fran doesn't sugar coat. Awesome reader."

"Thanks Fran, I always feel so much better and whole as a person & myself after talking with you. I appreciate your memory from each time we leave off and pick up again. God bless.

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